Something about playing an old Patrick Division rival in the playoffs just feels right.This will be the fourth time the Caps and Flyers have faced off in the postseason, with the Caps winning a pair of series (1984 and 1988) and the Flyers taking the 1989 match up.
And while the playoff history between these two teams has created some of the most memorable moments in either franchise's history, the games (be they regular or post-season) have usually had a common denominator - brutally physical play. Case in point, the Caps have only had more fighting majors against Boston and Atlanta since 1998-99 than they have had against Philly, proving that you can take the Caps out of the Patrick Division, but you can't take the Patrick Division out of the Caps.
Given that the Flyers plan to ramp up the physical play for the 2008 edition of the rivalry (to the delight of Pierre McGuire and others), I thought I'd take a moment and recap some of the pugilistic highlights of the teams' shared history (and if you like YouTubes of hockey fights - and who doesn't? - this is the post for you):
- In the three playoff series between the two teams, there have been 46 fighting majors in 16 games. Check out, for example, the first period of Game 3 of the 1984 Patrick Division Semifinals - seven minor penalties (including five hi-sticks and a rough), ten fighting majors and five 10-minute misconducts. 114 PIMs in one period. But that's nothing...
- The top home and road games for Caps, opponents and combined penalty minutes have both come against the Flyers in Washington blowout wins - a 6-0 win at Philly on December 21, 1980 in which the teams combined for 344 PIMs (check out Archie Henderson and Behn Wilson, not once, but twice) and a 5-2 home win on February 10, 1991 in which the teams combined for 294 penalty minutes.
- In a totally separate game (a 4-4 tie on March 27, 1982), the Caps and Flyers combined for 208 penalty minutes in a 49 second span of the second period.
- Six times a Flyer has had a Gordie Howe Hat Trick against the Caps, most recently Ron Sutter back in 1991.
- Alex Ovechkin's first NHL fight was against the Flyers' Mike Richards in a preseason game back in September, 2006.
- Speaking of Richards, he chucked knuckles with Brooks Laich earlier this season and had a bloody nose (and a win in the fight) to show for it.
- Another few bouts from this season - Chris Clark and Scott Hartnell, Matt Bradley and Jason Smith and former Cap Brian Sutherby against former Fly-boy Ben Eager.
- Donald Brashear has fought as a Flyer against the Caps six times since 1998-99 (here's one against Stephen Peat - watch out for that left, Peat! - and another for good measure), and against the Flyers as a Cap twice (earlier this season against Riley Cote, who he also fought in the preseason).
- Former Cap and Flyer Craig Berube was never afraid to start something, as a Flyer running Don Beaupre here (igniting the brawl you can see detailed at 12:04 of the third period here) and coming in with elbows high on an incredibly well-disciplined Scott Stevens here.
- While we're on the topic of goalies getting run, if you touched Scott Stevens' goalie - even if he pushed you into the goalie - you were going to answer. What a stud (seen brawling with the Flyers' Jeff Chychrun at the other end of the ice here). By the way, nice work by Smokin' Al on the color in those last few clips.
- You didn't think we'd get through this list without a little more Dale Hunter and Ron Hextall did you?
- The late John Kordic and Terry Carkner fought on February 10, 1991. Kordic played just seven games for the Caps, but racked up 101 PIMs, including 22 on that night.
- Bonus clip, with a special guest at the 1:08 mark.
- Here are Keith Jones and Joe Sacco throwing for some reason,and here's a real lightweight bout.
- Finally, if you like a good ol' fashioned bench-clearer, this one from back 1980 is for you (and here's another).
It's good to be back among old friends, no?
Big ups to Hockeyfights.com and Flyers History for making this post worthwhile.
35 comments:
Over/under on number of shifts before Scott Hartnell takes a run at Backstrom or Semin or Bradley or Fedorov or Laich or Fleischmann or Ovechkin. +/- 3.
1) Ahhh, the ole Patrick Division! Sorry, the same rivalries just have not developed in the SE. Seems the most intense games(Saturday not withstanding) are still when Philly, Pitt or the NYR come to town.
2) Nothing improves attendance like winning, but playing hated rivals regularly doesn't hurt either!
3) BTW, the old division names made the NHL unique among the team sports. The geographic names might help the non fan know where teams hail from, but the old Norris/Smyth/Adams, etc just had a nice feel.
Scott "The Vagina from Regina" Hartnell? Look at who he's fought this year. It takes a big man to fight Richard Zednik. LOL.
It's not Hartnell that concerns me so much as Downie. He's the real piece of... work.
Nice nickname, though.
Open topic:
Please understand that the Washington Capital's skill, which includes hard work, will take them past the Flyers. And if it does not, then it will be obvious that God has intervened.
Stop worrying about the Flyers and enjoy the ride.
Some of those score sheets are amazing. There was a double game misconduct (no idea how that happens). A "gross misconduct", but he didn't get a game misconduct to go along with that. You would think at some point they'd just start tossing people left and right instead of just giving them 10 minute misconduct penalties.
I can't believe you didn't mention Kelly Miller beating the crap out of 6'6" Kjell Samuelsson. That was a fine moment in Caps' history. Wonder if that's on youtube anywhere.
@ Ari - Good call. Brain fart on my part. Here's the box score from that game.
You've got to expect a Brash/Downie bout within the first 10 minutes (maybe 5) of game one. I expect Philly will want to come out and try to intimidate the Caps early, as they don't match up in the skill department. Boy, would I love to have Chris Clark back.
Leafs fan reporting for Capitals bandwagon duty!
Destroy the Flyers! No one likes Philadelphia!
i'm with Chemmy as part of the Leafs fan battalion. it's all about ovie and the capitals now, baby.
Another Leaf fan reporting for Caps bandwagon duty.
Any house rules us Leaf fans should know about?
I can't wait to see Ovie flatten the Flyers!
Welcome, Leafs fans - glad to have you aboard.
Any chance you can send Tomas Kaberle our way? He could probably fit in Sami Lepisto's sweater, no?
Line combos from practice:
Ovechkin-Backstrom-Kozlov
Semin-Fedorov-Cooke
Fleischmann-Laich-Gordon-Fehr
Brashear-Steckel-Bradely-Laing
Morrisonn-Green
Poti-Jurcina
Erskine-Eminger
Schultz-Lepsito-Sloan
I like Gordon on that third line. I'm guessing Fehr will suit up instead of Flash as he can take hits better and seems to have better balance/intensity.
eh, not so sure I like Schultz-Lepisto.
jp - we would send Tomas but he might like the playoff hockey too much.
Basically, all we can commit to right now is some cheering but if you send something back Kaberle could be available this summer...
Another Leaf fan here as part of the PPP crowd,ready to cheer for Ovie and the boys. I'll be the guy wearing a Wendel Clark jersey under my Red, White and Blue #8.
I would say that we are prepared to make a fellow by the name of Wozniewski available to play defense for you, but you guys - we, I mean - want to beat the damn Flyers, not allow them to walk in on Huet completely unmolested, am I right?
I like that all of a sudden we have a bunch of toronto fans showing up.
Chemmy, you couldn't be any more correct. I'm not even sure philedelphians (is that even a word? Fuggit, who cares) like the flyers, but they're all too busy being obnoxious drunks and starting fistfights to know any better.
Oh if only this were like the video games. I'd send out a team full of brashears for game 1. Sure, they might lose, technically, but there'd be no more philly players left after that game.
Hazardous - We went through an adoption process and figured the Caps were the best fit.
I like your idea of a team of Brashears. I hate him a lot but man, I'd love to see him put Downie through the boards.
Yes, we democratically agreed that we like Alexander Ovechkin so here we are.
Plus we hate Philly.
1) @Mark: We have to disagree that Philly doesn't match up with the Caps in the skill department. Sure they don't have an Ovechkin (who else does)!, but even without Gagne they have a pretty good set of forwards, and few are softies.
2) A possible help for the Caps might be that Hatcher is back. He couldn't skate too swiftly in the old NHL!
3) As is always the key to any series, its all about special teams. The caps have to make the Flyers pay for their anticipated aggressive play!
As a Boston fan, this series is interesting for me. The Caps have a few forwards who have more skill, but overall the Flyers are a pretty balanced team up front, with one big difference - they play with a lot more grit than almost anyone in the league. You can debate about the ethics all you want, but let's remember that the Ducks were viewed the same way when they made their Cup run. It always helps to have a Pronger or a Niedermayer or an Ovechkin on your squad, but teams can be more than the sum of their parts if it's the right chemistry.
You also can't argue with success, and the Caps, Flyers, Bruins, and Habs are all proof of that. Each team took a different path to where they are, but right now everyone's record is 0-0 and we're going to get to find out who does it best.
Going back to the 97-98 season only ONE TEAM that has won the Cup was involved in more than 50 fights. And that was the 'Thug' Ducks. Why does everyone one bring it up? Do you have to play dirty and fight everyone to have grit??? Apparently not, cause those teams don't succeed in the playoffs according to history, where all of this 'grit' is needed. Maybe the term grit, should be changed to heart or passion, in which case I don't think any debate is in order as to which team has more of that.
I don't think "everyone" brings it up, but those that do, do so for a pretty simple reason: it's relevant. The Ducks proved it. Detroit proved it. New Jersey proved it. Those squads all did different things exceptionally well, but they all shared the common trait of having a nasty streak when needed. Nobody says 'grit' is defined by taking dumb penalties or thuggery, but it does involve a certain disdain for the more polite aspects of the game.
You cannot look at any of the teams that have won the cup in the last decade and say that they have not shared that quality, excepting MAYBE the Tampa Bay Lightning, who were taken to the limit by a physical, tough Flames team.
This is not to say the Flyers will win, merely to state that we are going to see a lot of different ways to play hockey in the coming weeks and it should be engaging at the least.
@Gordon:
Understood. But everything I've been reading is how much Philly is gonna beat us up. Ohhhh the bloodshed! Can the Caps handle it? It's not like they're playing PowderPuff football out there. My point is that "grit" comes in many different forms...and the form that the Flyers and there fans seem to 'threaten' us with is the kind that doesn't win Stanley Cups.
Great post! I didn't even know the Caps had 25 comments worth of fans..... Just kiddin, good luck fellas.... I gotta agree with the experts and call this Caps in 6, but I'll be pulling for the Fly-guys and expecting lots of blood. Ugh, even a 1-year hiatus from playoff hockey is too much.
"I expect Philly will want to come out and try to intimidate the Caps early, as they don't match up in the skill department."
That's a laugh! The Flyers have 12 players with 30+ points and 7 with 20+ goals. OV's skill is unmatched, no doubt, but one man does not a team make.
The Caps are in the South East Division, arguably the weakest in the NHL. The wouldn't have even made the playoffs if they were in a tougher divison.
Flyers in 5.
@anonymous:
Remind me again what division two of the last 3 stanley cup winners play in?
@ tj
remind me, are either of those teams in the playoffs?
And while a few of you seem like true, informed fans (does NOT include the leafs fans, and I think everyone should be impressed with Ari), I wonder how many fake fans are going to try to heckle me when I'm wearing my orange and black on Sunday. For YEARS I've bought tickets from the box office within days of when the Flyers were in town...and suddenly it's a sea of red!!!! What were you, bottom 5 in attendance?
ESPN needs to get off DC's nuts and realize the Flyers win in 6.
PS even I feel bad for Olie.
Great job on this. Brings back good memories of my youth, watching the old Patrick Division stuff.
By the way, Dan Kordic might be surprised to read that he is dead.
While Danny Kordic was in that fight, I think the deceased fighting member of the Kordic family you were looking for is John Kordic.
@ JD - Actually, it is John Kordic in the fight. Dan Kordic never played for the Caps (he was a Flyer, though).
Yikes, good call. Need more coffee.
Have a good weekend and enjoy the series!
HEX-tall...HEX-tall...HEX-tall...
I'm so looking forward to this game tonight...
I was hoping that the Flyers would beat Washington in the Conference Finals, but the PENS threw the last game.
Although a Flyers fan (despite what chemmy says), I do like Ovechkin. I was hoping that the CAPS would have matched up with the PENS so you could see how much better he is than Sis the Kid.
GO FLYERS!!
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